Welcome to the Virtual Women and Gender in International Development Discussion Series.
This is our third and final event for fall 2024 and we're happy that you could all
join us virtually today for the discussion featuring Dr. Kalpana Giri as guest speaker.
As of this morning, we had 79 people registered for today's event.
Besides lots of students, faculty and staff from Virginia Tech that
include people from many different countries,
We have folks joining us from other US universities UT Austin,
Princeton University and other universities across
the world including Carleton University in Canada and Vinh University in Vietnam
and we have several universities in the US including the Borlaug Institute
for International Agriculture, USAID and then we have World Resources Institute,
Forest action Nepal, Institute of Forestry
and more folks from Nepal, Great Britain, Vietnam, Uganda and Canada and maybe more this morning.
Welcome to all of you. Please note that our event
will be recorded and available on our website later so for all participants.
By staying on, you're consenting to being recorded. You can turn
your camera off if you don't want your image to be recorded.
So before introducing our speaker, I invite you to reflect on Virginia
Tech's land and labor recognition. I will read you a summary of that and
Pratirakshya is going to put the link to the full statement on the Virginia Tech website.
Virginia Tech acknowledges that we live and work on the Tutelo / Monacan People’s
homeland, and we recognize their continued relationships with their lands and waterways.
We further acknowledge that the Morrill Land-Grant College Act (1862) enabled
the commonwealth of Virginia to finance and found Virginia Tech through the forced removal
of Native Nations from their lands in California and other areas in the West.
We also recognize that enslaved Black people generated revenue and resources
used to establish Virginia Tech and were prohibited from attending until 1953.
Through InclusiveVT, the institutional and individual commitment to Ut Prosim
(that I may serve) in the spirit of community, diversity, and excellence,
we commit to advancing a more diverse, equitable, and inclusive community.
Some brief housekeeping notes. This talk will last approximately 45 minutes. Our speaker presentation
will be about 20-25 minutes followed by about 20 minutes of discussion and Q&A with the audience.
So all participants will be muted to enable the speaker to present without interruption as always.
In order for our discussion to be as rich as it can be,
we need everyone to be respectful and treat all participants with kindness and consideration
without discriminatory behavior. So if anyone is disrespectful including interrupting a speaker
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So anyway, after the speaker's presentation,
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Pratirakshya will tell you how to do that. We'll ask you to unmute yourself to talk directly.
So this is called a discussion series. It's not just a lecture. So we really encourage people
to communicate verbally as well as in writing. But if you're shy, I'm happy to read it for you.
Or if your internet connection is not good. Sometimes that's
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So again, the webinar is being recorded. That
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In advance, I'd like you at the end when Pratirakshya puts the link in
for the survey, please do fill out the survey.
It really helps us to get feedback for planning and funding.
Now I know what you really want to see here, Kalpana Giri. So let me introduce her.
She is a senior manager in the World Resources Institute and works to expand
WRI's ambitions on social equity by research and gender and equity integrated programming.
Kalpana is a trained forester and has demonstrated experience in mainstreaming
gender and social equity considerations in technical sectors, programming with a focus
on forestry, clean energy, REDD+, climate adaptation, FLEGT and restoration topics.
Prior to joining WRI, she worked with RECOFTC where she managed
the direction and portfolio of equity integration.
She designed and implemented a regional waves leadership program in partnership
with sectoral ministries, private sector women and indigenous groups
to promote transformative solutions for the environment and people across
forestry and climate change policies and plans.
She's a thought leader on topics of gender and social equity in forestry and climate change.
and advises several international organizations to strengthen their gender strategies and portfolio.
So Kalpana holds a PhD in forest science from the University of Natural Resources
and Applied Life Sciences in Vienna, Austria.
Her direct experience of working with diverse stakeholders, including marginalized actors,
have made her more aware of the acute need and usefulness of
plural knowledge systems held by marginalized actors in addressing major environmental issues.
Drawing on insights from the Global Restoration Initiative led by World Resources Institute,
today she will shed light on ways in which gender and social equity approaches
are implemented in restoration practice
and discuss its implications for navigating the complex interplay
of restoration, climate change, and social justice through development practice.
So the title of her talk is Beyond the Critiques and Ambitions of
Equity Mainstreaming in restoration practice: lessons from the Global Restoration Initiative
Now I'm going to mute myself. And I'm going to share my screen. So Kalpana,
you'll have to just tell me next, okay?
Okay, sounds good. Thank you.
All right. Thank you so much, Marie Elisa Christie. Hello, everyone. Namaste.
I'm very pleased to be in this space. Once again, thanks to Mary Elisa Christie for inviting me to
this space and also to Virginia Tech University for holding this space.
Today, I'll be sharing some insights of doing equity in
restoration practice within the nexus of climate change.
But before I do that, I would also like to share some context so you
understand where my knowledge and insights are coming from.
So I think I'm drawing my insights from my lived experience, you know,
as a university trained forester as well as my work experience.
I'm trained as a forest engineer and forest is my major degree.
However, I started to observe some disconnect between the
first curricula and the practice. And that made me curious to learn more.
So I ended up reading, learning, and more,
I connected to the right networks and mentors that talked about sociology of forests.
And eventually I ended up doing a PhD in forestry.
For my PhD, I examine the topics of forest governance from a wider
sociological lens that also included gender and governance perspective.
So this combined knowledge of technical and social sciences has really helped me tremendously.
First, I think it really expanded my abilities to better understand environmental problems and
create impactful solutions that really work for the people on the ground.
Second, I also think that this knowledge also expanded my abilities and it also
expanded better and more job choices for me.
And last but not least, it really gave me a choice to choose the
type of organization and the type of work that I really want to engage.
Because I want my work to be meaningful and create some impacts.
Having those abilities really puts me in a space where I'm choosing the jobs
and the organization that I want to work with.
And that's really a privilege.
So today I will share some of these practical examples of how
equity mainstreaming or gender and social equity mainstreaming
actually is done in practice. And to do that,
I'll give a snapshot of my current work at the World Resource Institute.
So I think for many of you, if you don't know World Resource Institute, or in short, WRI,
It's a nonprofit organization that tackles global
environmental issues affecting nature, people, and the climate.
It works on multiple different environmental topics ranging
from land, food, water, ocean, and cities.
Forests and land degradation and deforestation is one key topic.
Within WRA, I'm part of an initiative that is called Global Restoration Initiative.
This initiative aims to restore millions of hectares of deforested and degraded land
across three geographies globally, in Asia, Africa, and Latin America.
It works with 52 countries and in partnership with almost 500 partners on the ground,
including government, business, and communities around the world.
I lead and manage the equity integration work of Global Restoration Initiative.
Just to add a bit of context here on what restoration really implies, restoration efforts
are extremely essential to the global efforts of reversing land degradation and climate change.
It is important also to ensure that people who actually heavily
depend on these resources are also not left behind and they
improve their resilience through the efforts that we put true restoration.
And restoration is often used as an umbrella term that revolves around land degradation.
But it involves a lot of technical interventions such as agroforestry,
reforestation, silver pasture, water management,
assisted natural regeneration, tree planting, and so on and so forth, right?
So for some of you are really focusing on foresty is a major, I think know that a bunch of
different interventions are actually clubbed under restoration as a potential major of interventions.
Restoration is also chosen because it offers the potential to deliver solutions
that are on ground that are also cost effective and that are multiple in nature,
multiple in the sense that it can generate environmental, social, and economical solutions.
As such, there is an increasing commitment,
pledges and ambitions being set to implement restoration solutions.
Initiatives like AFRO 100, which stands for the African Forest Landscape Restoration Initiative,
and the 2020 initiative are an example of that.
Both AFR100 and 2020 initiatives are country-led efforts.
But they aim to implement 100 millions of actors,
100 million hectares of land in Africa under restoration by 2030.
And 50 million hectares of degraded land
into conservation and restoration in Latin America and Caribbean.
And I think despite this place is an ambition, we also need to understand that the progress is slow.
And there are certain critics that surround whether restoration is really equitable or not.
If you really look around the literature and condense the major
patterns that are coming out of the study, studies shows two distinct patterns.
First inequities are scalar to restoration and that means that they persist across
all level of restoration, whether it's at the agenda setting level
to implementation to including different plural knowledge systems or representing
different needs and priorities of different actors, also the marginalized communities.
Second, despite the call for reforms on equity implementation.
The dominant practice or the dominant ways through which gender and social
equity mainstreaming is usually applied across environmental organizations,
including in climate change practice has highly remained problematic.
They show a trend where equity aspects remain highly superficial,
often done just to tick the box and to match the funding request.
But by doing so, they often create a space where equity
specs are depoliticized, they become devalued.
And remain inadequately accounted within project
designs and outcomes. And this really leads to limited outcomes for social change.
So if we really combine these two patterns, then it really looks like a very serious issue,
right? And what can we really do around that?
The question then becomes, how can we really do equity implementation
right in restoration programs and what would enable that?
So today I really invite you to learn, discuss and consider how we can do that.
I would like to share with you two examples from the Global Restoration
Initiative where I and a lot of champions from my team engage in this process and
supported equity implementation within those two programs.
The first program, the first example is about Terra Fund for AFR100 program.
So Terra Fund for AFR100 program is basically terra fund is a fund. It's a blended finance fund.
It aims to incentivize restoration on the ground through finance, data, and partnerships.
It supports implementation of restoration solution across Africa, including in three key landscapes.
The Great Rift Valley in Kenya, Lake Kivu, and the Rasuji Basin, and the Ghana Cocoa Belt.
WRI's role in this space is that WRI co-creates the design and delivery
with the partners through a platform called Terra Match.
It offers funding, data, platform,
policy, and equity support to the partners to implement restoration.
So TerraFund is basically a blended finance fund. And why TerraFund was important is because
Some of the money, the traditional pocket of money or funding that
goes into restoration and climate change, it is very less and limited.
A lot of dependency alone will actually create a dependency syndrome of countries
Always looking out for money so can the money be used in a way that it
can really incentivize the economy that is based on restoration on the ground.
And that was the vision that Terrafund took.
In order to do that, it really wants to mobilize private finance
to support restoration economies on the ground.
And it wants to do it in a way that it remains locally relevant, equitable,
and that it provides secure jobs and livelihoods
to the communities we actually do restoration on the ground. And to do that, for now,
what it does is that it provides targeted funding, direct funding
to profit and nonprofit organizations that undertake restoration projects in Africa.
And these restoration projects grow trees, restore land, and generate social impacts.
The demand for this program is huge. We have received,
we launched this program since September 2021.
And until now, we have received almost more than 3,000 application
and we're able to fund only 198 projects in 27 countries in Africa.
And we have dispersed 32 million to support restoration implementation on the ground.
So how does equity really come into integration within a fund like terra fund?
So the process of equity integration or implementation in Terrafund really begin with.
I think me working with the team,
understanding the nature of their program, what the program really wants to deliver.
And then bringing some of my social skills to conduct the social gender
and social data analysis and finding some really key gaps and priorities and then
throwing that back to the bigger team for discussion and deliberation.
Here, in addition to the data sharing and deliberation,
what really happened is I think I was also able to translate some of the
equity data and concepts around gender and social equity,
gender gaps, rights and power dynamics within the concept of running a fund.
What does that really look like to the fund in very simple terms?
In simple terms, equity efforts were really placed in two areas.
The first area is at the funding label because
terra fund is essentially a fund. It disperses the funds.
The first step is to really examine whether or not Terra Fund is able to disperse this funding
to the groups that actually face more constraint barriers to access funding.
So when we did that research, we find that especially woman-led
and youth-led enterprises often face much more constant barriers to access funding.
Therefore, we prioritize them in our funding allocations.
Second, restoration ultimately wants to incentivize local economies,
local jobs and livelihoods at the ground.
And therefore, it is important that we really position people as a key
element within restoration practice. This means that
restoration projects generate benefits such as jobs, livelihoods, trainings, networks.
and more, and that these benefits also go and reach to disadvantaged
groups within those communities at the local level, such as
to smallholder farmers, women, youth, indigenous communities, and so on and so forth.
So with these ideas, we solidified these goals. We really created some
specific criteria into the waiting criteria.
We evaluated project application based on those criteria. We selected
a diverse team of local and global experts with diverse expertise.
Who can evaluate the proposal so that the evaluation scores remains fair and balanced.
And then we also equipped Terrafund's data and monitoring system through TerraMatch so that
we can capture disaggregated information, analyze that over time, and make timely improvements on
where the gains are being made and what needs to be improved within our team and strategies.
So if we really look at the early results, the early results actually
show that terrafund delivers results, both environmental, social and financial results.
Over 50% of the terrafund funding where supported women and youth-led organizations
And it created significant land restoration jobs and livelihoods at scale.
So this is huge. This is equity at scale kind of result that is delivered by Terra Fund.
And one of the interesting innovation that happened here is that while we evaluated
project applications through the waiting criteria and conducted some interviews to understand
different type of power dynamics and engagement model they use.
What really came out interestingly is to
realize that there are already some organizations in Africa
that are very serious about gender and social equity. They were very innovative in terms of
crafting their engagement model to reach out to local farmers, poor farmers, pasturalists.
And then some of the businesses really had their business proposition model built in a way that
More than 80% of their businesses are catering to women,
right? So women ended up getting jobs, youth ended getting jobs.
So there's a lot of potential and untapped opportunity that exists
around these projects, which we have not analyzed yet, right? And that's what we really want to do
moving forward.
So from Terra Fund in Africa, now let's move to the 2020 initiative
that focuses in Latin America and the Caribbean.
The Initiative 2020 is a regional partnership that aims to bring more
than 50 million hectares of degraded land into conservation and restoration by 2030.
Within Latin America and the Caribbean, AFOLU or Agriculture,
forestry and Land Use Sectors, is a key sector in the region that
is set to achieve climate targets of adaptation, mitigation, land degradation and restoration.
And in this role, in this space, WRI serves as the Secretariat of the 2020 initiative and
provides engagement, convening, technical support and also provide supports to mobilize funding.
The nature of 2020 initiative is a bit different than the Terra Fund
because Terra Fund is a fund, 2020 is a platform.
So for 2020 initiative, engagement and partnership is key element to its design and delivery.
It deliberately aims to ensure diversity
of partnerships to create an inclusive engagement process
is a matter of fact, part of the success of this initiative is measured by the
members of the community and how they feel about this the whole engagement process.
Till date, the initiative engaged with 18 countries,
136 technical partners, 32 financial partners
And it has very dedicated tax force on technical topics such as biodiversity,
assisted natural regeneration.
carbon markets and investment ecosystem, monitoring,
policy and incentives and so on and so forth.
Here, WR's role is that WRF facilitates this space, is the secretariat.
And as such, equity became a criterion that could be really important to club
within the stakeholder engagement processes.
More specifically, how equities brought into 2020 is through this
four elements. First, we really identify diverse partners that are with very
different type of experience to participate in this initiative.
And these partners really share and play a decisive co-creative role in
how restoration agendas are set and implemented.
So this is a central element of sharing the power
of decision making with the partners that really makes it equitable.
Second, I think problems are really identified from the ground and then they are brought
through to this platform. And then WRA also supported partners in terms
of data-driven research and collaboration so that
Some key emerging priorities are kind of validated through
data and collaborative processes on the ground.
We are also in discussion to design and establish a dedicated tax group that is
going to focus on equity, mainly on gender and social equity aspects of restoration.
And this is done because we realize that while a lot has been done through the engagement
processes, I think if we really center the gender and social equity as one dedicated pillar element,
it will really give them the visibility and the privilege of being positioned as
a central element and it will be easier to run the discussions around that.
Fourth I think the initiative creates regular knowledge exchanges among partners. So it
treats the partners as people who have knowledges, good knowledges to
share with the wider group. So this knowledge exchange also
creates a loop of learning and positive influence among different partners.
And because partners choose on-ground issues and solutions through collaborative processes,
most of those solutions include both technical and social results.
So if we really look into the early results again with the 2020, this shows impressive results.
2020 has supported 17.5 million hectares of restored land in Latin America and Caribbean.
It also had links to multiple impressive social results.
The social results here are in terms of knowledge
transfer through community of practice, which is really key.
It also accelerated some of the funding through the platform.
It also enables some of the strategic planning and help many different countries in preparation to
the National Restoration plan that includes measures
to increase positive social impacts as well.
But if I really look at it as an equity person from far, I really feel that within 2020
initiative, there's a strong sense of ownership and engagement and deliberation of partners.
that is very unique to the initiative itself.
I see that as a reflection of the success of an equitable engagement
process that is plugged within how 2020 is designed, governed, and run.
So what do we really make out of for this example right like
We can look at these examples from very different angle,
but for today's session, where I really want to bring you
is that I really wanted you to see that equity integration in
both Terra Fund and 2020 initiative give us different important takeaways.
I think one of the most important takeaway for me, and I think I want to leave that to you as well,
is that equity implementation or mainstreaming when it's done right.
it can yield significant social, environmental,
financial impacts that matter to people, that matter to climate, that may matter to nature.
It's a win-win strategy because it helps to innovate projects design,
create inclusive engagement spaces, mitigate gender and social gaps
and achieve social results that really matter to the people who
really need these benefits and opportunities.
Second, I also think that mixed knowledge of technical and social
sciences is hugely helpful for equity implementation.
Because it creates shared understanding, trust and openness.
among the team, which is sometimes very helpful to navigate disagreements,
to navigate tension points, and
to find out the reason of why other person is not really moving forward with one idea,
right? Sometimes that's not plain resistance.
Sometimes it's like the person is not really familiar with what this
process really entails in terms of actual actions and activities
and why that is important for this project.
This knowledge, I would say,
is also very useful to identify champions both within the team and outside the team.
Why that is important is because I think the mixed knowledge really puts you in a space where you
can see where the other person is coming from,
right? Either the person is a trend forester, what is really
important to that person, why that person is analyzing certain issues in
that way. And also from the social science perspective, sometimes we really feel that
Why the right issues are so important to bring into this discussion. And if
that doesn't happen to the extent that social scientists always want,
why that also creates a sense of frustration with the pace and the quality of integration.
So for me, I always find that this knowledge has been hugely helpful for me to bridge bond
and engage with the right champions. And without champions, we cannot really move it forward.
And also, I think along with this,
I would like to leave a message that whenever we are thinking about
You know, like climate change solutions or environmental issues
please always think them as a holistic solutions. We need holistic solutions. We don't need
technical solution or social solution or financial solution. We need all the three integrated.
And there, I think the knowledge needs to come through
is integrated and solutions needs to come through as integrated as well.
What really helped in this process to me is some enablers apart from
the knowledge and the team and champions, is that
Having budget does help because at the end of the time we are trying to move projects
on the ground. So resource is a huge, huge enabler and then champions are hugely useful.
Without champions, we cannot really move it forward. Some barriers that
I experienced in this process is that
Sometimes we speak very different languages and use very different type of terms.
So it takes a lot of time and effort to understand that though we use different terms,
we are basically meaning the same things. But most of the people really don't want to move forward
Beyond the terminologies, they don't want to talk about substance. And
so how do we really cultivate that kind of, you know, language bridge
that always remains a challenge. Someone really has to pick that conversation,
be that conversation maker. And that takes a lot of
time and effort, which is always unseen and unaccounted for.
It also requires a lot of patience and perseverance because people are
coming from very different technical paradigm of
what restoration is and should be. And sometime on a very subconscious level, I think
Our forestry degrees sometimes can also make us very egoistical and
blind to understand what is actually happening and needed in the field.
And examining yourself on a very personal level, it does feel vulnerable, right?
And so I think it requires a lot of patience and time for people to kind
of allow that space and for them to, you know, build some understanding around that.
And because equity implementation always is about
discussion and deliberation and decision making sometime
if there are not spaces that allow equitable decision making and sharing of power,
even within team members, then that means
One aspect might get weighted more than the other. And that's another challenge.
So I think I want to move forward and really like
bring this back to the audience that I'm speaking with you today.
So how can we really think through these
learning points and some of the enablers and barriers, right?
If I were a forest student, like some of you are 15 years ago, you know,
like I was a first student like you. What would I say?
I would really encourage all the students that you know like first degree is a STEM degree. You
might have your own inclinations and aspirations of why you chose
to study forestry. So be proud of that identity. Build on the forestry knowledge,
right? But then don't hold yourself limited by it.
Be open and curious to also understand multiple scientific
perspectives, right? So I think being openness and curious is key here,
especially if you're a student and you are engaging in this space.
Second, if you ever get a chance to learn directly from a local community,
consider that your golden opportunity, right?
Because if you just go and talk to a community member, either with the forest dependent
community or indigenous people, and the way they associate forest and natural resources.
And the way we learn about forests and natural resources in university, there's a huge divide.
But learning both will really make you wise,
right? And so I think please consider that as a golden opportunity. Seek for those opportunities.
The third thing I would always say is that ground your views on
real world conditions. And this is extremely important, right?
My curiosity began when I started to notice that on-ground conditions
of forest practice in Nepal did not really match
some of the curricula that was being given to me through the
first universities and i become curious.
But at the end of the day,
if you really wanted your knowledge to be contributing to the field of praxis.
Simple logic is that it needs to be relevant to the real world conditions,
right? And so if so ground your views in the real world
condition and think how can forestry knowledge and practice can help me
to deliver and to address those real world issues and condition. And in that process,
please be open for relearning. That's extremely important and growth.
I think embracing some level of openness, adaptability and respect to diverse views,
knowledges and people is extremely important.
This especially is important because I think in some universities and contexts,
forestry or STEM degree is seen as
kind of a little bit, you know, like degree that require more
intellect or that is considered a little bit of a more hierarchy
Compared to other topics such as in social sciences. And I get to
hear that personally from a lot of my forester friends that, oh,
now you become a social scientist. You are not anymore a forester, for example, right?
So I think let's not reach there. That's a very limited
field to be in. So please resist that subconscious tendency to be encumbered.
by the burden's limit or ego of your science knowledge paradigm.
And don't be encumbered, right? Carry it.
We do, but then be open to make it wider.
This is my message to the forest students and to forest faculty
and academia or to the Alma Mater. I would like to say some of these points as well.
I would also see that first universities like
Virginia Tech can also play a huge important role around here.
And this can take shape in many different forms. For example,
universities can really diversify and teach curricula that reflects
the on-ground situation and needs of forestry practice on the ground.
This can be done in different ways. I think you can curate inclusive spaces of belonging,
representation, and voices of diverse genders and actors.
in being invited into this space is one example of that.
You can also foster action research with mixed methods and knowledge
exchanges because that's extremely important.
We foster that type of critical inquiry that comes from field of practice and
comes through different type of knowledge systems.
So the students are equipped to embrace that kind of knowledge and see the value around it.
And I think if we can also do something that would really help the students
to do critical inquiry, but with self-reflexivity and power sharing. That is hugely helpful.
I'm saying this because I think as a forester,
I always felt that forest fraternity is mostly in many countries implementing is paramilitary
And most of the foresters really hold that power to themselves that, oh,
they are the ones who are going to manage the forest and all the people that don't
Listen to them are kind of outsiders and they need to be treated with penalty and as such.
And I think that really reflects on where that kind of connotation came from. Most of those
connotations came from early forest universities that really focused on traditional conservation,
a little bit of neocolonialistic Western models of
what forests to ease and how forests should be managed.
But then forced practice has evolved since then. We have
learned a lot about community forests, indigenous peoples.
ways of looking at forests, how that are also very
useful ways of managing the forest and forest resources.
But we have not really in cultivated the virtue of self-reflexivity within
foresters. And this is something that universities really need to think through.
I find foresters who are excellent technical experts, but they lack zero empathy.
And universal skills. And I don't think, you know, the job market really needs that type of people.
So I think in order to, you know, like mitigate that gap,
we really need to think about cultivating those kind of aptitude skills as well.
And last but not least, and this is a difficult one because I feel like
Whenever we think about all my matter,
back to all the first universities that I went to, I really wish they have
taught me forestry in a very wider and holistic ways.
What I really mean to say here is that I think forestry curriculum is still very traditional.
It has not expanded to the extent it should have expanded. And that's
kind of a disservice because we already know that there are so
useful mechanisms, local indigenous practice around forestry that exist.
So how do we bring those back within this creative thinking and curriculum
making process and redefine and pluralize forest science.
And I think that's really important because if we
really want to tackle the urgency of climate change, environmental crisis,
We cannot do with the science or analysis system, which is very sectoral and which is
very narrow and which is far from meeting the needs on the ground.
I want to thank you and I also want to thank some of my team members from the
World Resource Institute, especially from the Global Restoration Initiative, namely
Adena Zamora, who leads the 2020 initiative, Will Anderson, who leads the AFR100 initiative,
and Sean David, who manages the Global Restoration Initiative.
This is a collective effort. And so thank you. And again,
thank you to Maria Elisa Christie and the university for having me.
Thank you. Over to you. And I'm happy to answer any questions.
Okay, wow. Thank you, Kalpana. That was great.
It's very exciting to see.
You know, it was like 15 years ago that you and I started working on gender and forestry in Nepal.
So it's really exciting to see that you're now working with WRI and all the
different things that you're doing. And thank you for so many messages
to our students and faculty here at Virginia Tech.
I want to say there was an oversight. I forgot to say at the beginning, it's very important.
This talk is also co-hosted by Diverse Voices and Perspectives lecture series.
So that's very important. And because we are also part of International Education Week,
which is not only here at Virginia Tech, but
So hopefully that brought some audience to our thing
today that wouldn't have heard about it otherwise.
So, okay, so now we have time for questions. I didn't see very many in the
questions, but if you want to raise your hand, then I can call on you.
If you want to make a comment or have a question, that is how we would proceed now.
Yes, I see a question. Okay, let's see. Am I still on mute? Yes. Okay, from Bonnie Zaire.
And Bonnie's our director here at Virginia Tech, our director of Women's and Gender and
Sexuality Studies. Bonnie, are you wanting to speak yourself? Do you want me to read this?
I'd be happy to read it. Thank you.
Okay, great.
Thanks so much for being here.
I was wondering to what degree you feel you're
directly taking on capitalist policy as you do this work?
Do you see your work, and then part two, do you see your work
fitting into a transnational feminist perspective where you're working across
borders and keeping the excesses of hyper capitalist policies in mind?
Or do you see it more as third world feminism where you're looking more at
the local context and listening to the people and using that as sort of the springboard?
Thank you. Thank you so much. I think that's a very difficult question, but thanks for asking.
To begin with, what I would really like to say is that I am a strong
believer of justice and rights. I consider myself a huge feminist,
right? And I do call out issues when I see some wrongdoings around that.
But also, I think I would need to reflect that I work in a development practice, which is highly
based on institutions and structures that is neo-colonistic in nature, right? And so
And third is whenever you are working with topics like restoration, you are engaging
with local communities and that really brings me into this blended spaces where
I think the utility of one principle doesn't hold value. What really holds value is what
is the need of the local communities, where do they really want themselves see going, right?
And if they really need jobs and livelihood and they wanted
more local economies coming out of restoration,
do we really think that is a translation of neoliberal or neo-capitalistic model
Or do you rather think that is something that local people
really want and that they really want it to move their life forward, right?
And I think these questions therefore also needs to be thought from the practical perspective.
How do we bring it on the ground? What are we really seeing it
And it's a gray area. I would totally admit that sometimes it might feel that,
oh, maybe it's a very heavy model, right?
We have been very conscious and intentional in our efforts in global restoration initiative to
not simply borrow that idea, but really engage the local actors and communities to
understand what they are coming from,
what kind of modality might be the best modality to work around that.
One way we do that is we do not really fund large scale restoration,
right? Like large companies going there and just engaging communities is
extractive laborers, we don't do that. We rather made a decision to fund a small organization that
do quality type of work on restoration, but do generate some markets and money.
Because that is also essential to create jobs and give back
to the communities. So this is, I would say.
I do not see those areas as very divergent, you know,
because of this experience now. Before I was like, no, I don't want to engage in that space.
But now I feel that in the practice, conceptually,
there are huge divides between finance and equity. The science doesn't even meet.
But then in practice. You realize that they actually come together. And I
think that's how I would like to really frame it.
Any more questions or comments?
I saw that Bonnie also put in the chat, please be open for relearning is a great message.
I made a note of something about you said how you know different paradigms
require patience since I work in a multidisciplinary environment and
Virginia tech is doing work in restoration and it is, you know,
different experts from very different fields so.
The idea that you need patience and also respect for each other
in this kind of hierarchical thing is really important. So I appreciated that.
Yeah, I think on that, I really wanted to say that
I think before, you know, like if you really met me 10 years before,
I think I would really get angry on those kind of interfaces.
I did not really have the skills it developed on how do you actually navigate through
that. So I would also say that that's a huge skill set that would develop as a
is a person working on transdisciplinary or interdisciplinary teams
And that requires effort. It doesn't just come by,
right? Like I think you go through the process, you reflect on it.
For me, what really helped, I think the mix of knowledges always helped me because
if let's say a forest minister say that,
oh, I really don't understand why they are always talking about human rights.
I really don't get like we are doing forest protection and local
communities engagement. What more do they want?
then I know that for this person, first protection is the main area that they're
concerned about, right? They don't really can even bring them to think about human rights.
They are like human rights should be done by someone else,
not by forestry Ministries, right? So that's the
a level of thinking and space that they're operating from. And so when you know that.
You cannot be angry with them anymore. Rather, you would say,
okay, here we are using different terms, but where does the connection actually comes
close to both sides of the world,
right? So sometimes I feel that kind of translation of perhaps did not um
Simplifying the bigger concepts of equity, human rights, feminism
within some simple terms that sound digestible to the other
sector might be helpful to open up conversation.
Yeah, but sometimes I also feel that the challenge is
there. Sometimes you also feel that you're hitting the wall.
There's no, you know, like windows out there to open up. And at times you feel that you
are not with the right people and right team to even initiate those conversations.
Yep.
We have several comments in the chat. I hope people are reading the chat.
They're not questions, so I'm not going to read them,
but please feel free to keep putting your comments.
I want to say since we're coming to the end, I do want to say, I think Pratirakshya has
already put the link for the survey and we'll also send it when this is over.
I want to let you know that we have a great lineup also for the Spring, including presentations on
on India as a megacity, on Colombia, and in April, a final presentation looking at the
Andes in Appalachia from a food geography perspective.
When you do the survey, you have the option to sign on to our WGD listserv and then you
will get the information about that. Or you can just come back and look at our website.
But our next event won't be till February.
So if we don't have more questions, I'm gonna ask Kalpana, is there anything?
I actually thought of this in our last speaker,
and it was the first time I thought of it, but I want to ask you,
is there anything else you'd like to say that crammed into your 20, 25 minute presentation.
Not so much on the content, but I think I just wanted to leave a
message back to the team and to you, Maria Elisa Christie, that
Sometimes, you know, you don't um how should I put it?
You don't plan everything, you know, like a strategist, right?
I think if I really recall the connection we made to do the work in Nepal,
it was a very impromptu connection that we made. And we said, okay, let's
do a small research and find out how women foresters feel about
their choices and experiences in forestry.
And we connected from there. We published some data,
did a research and things like that right and then
In between, we connected.
And then later, when I moved to US,
then we connected again and now I'm here, right? So sometimes I think
To students, I would also say that I mean, if my PhD has taught me one thing,
it is to trust on my vibe's or on my feelings, right?
Because I think the more depth you go, you identify yourself more clearly.
Who are you as a person? What do you want?
What kind of networks and mentors you want to be associated with,
what kind of people really consume your energy and you don't want to be around that.
So I think I want to say this, especially if there are students listening to this, is that
Don't spend too much time in over planning and being a strategist, right? Go with the flow.
Allow yourself the space to be you and then
through your job, through PhDs, you know, through different new jobs and experiences that you own
discern what you like and what you don't like,
right? And if you like certain networks and groups and people
be in touch, right? And you don't really have to send like 10 emails for that,
but just like an occasional hello and appreciating the readings and papers. I think that's how you
create very real authentic relationship
And now I just want to reflect that because I
think I and Maria Elisa Christie connected because of one thing.
And now I'm here again reconnecting, I think after 10 years on this space with all of you, right?
And so please take this as the virtue or the
you know is the feel of collaboration and the need of connecting to the right people
and networks. And I think eventually that will bring you into a space where
you feel more comfortable, you are supported by the mentors and peers.
And they are also your go-to people when you feel like
Nothing is moving. There's a wall heating and things like that, right? So I think
I just wanted to flag that and also say thank you to Marie Alyssa Christie for
the partnership we formed and for bringing me into this space yet again. Thank you.
Well, thank you, Kalpana. I see that we have a new message and we still have a few
minutes. So Maureen, I asked, but you didn't answer my text. Do you want to
read it out loud? Otherwise, I'm going to go ahead and read it for you. I'll
give you a minute to unmute yourself if you'd like to read it yourself.
Okay, I'm going to go ahead and read it. And the question for Maureen Agada is,
what strategies have you found most effective?
for opening up conversations and breaking down walls with
team members who may not be initially receptive to equity-focused discussions.
Yeah, I think that's really interesting. What really helps is I think one is pick
the conversation, right? So for example, if I feel like some people are really not keen,
I say, hey, can we actually talk over coffee?
And have a chat around that. So I think be the one who picks on the conversation, first of all,
right? Don't be afraid to do that. Don't feel like resistance and don't plan things too much,
right? Don't overthink and say that I just want to go and have a chat with this person.
And if the person are coming from very different sectors,
like financial sectors, technical sectors.
You know, like allow yourself to also think that they might not be knowing anything about
equity and the thing that you're making is not making sense to them right and so
go with that kind of openness in your mind. So that always helps.
So be the conversation starter, pick that conversation. Second.
Help them. Second, I think
Leave the jargons and focus on the substance, right? That's what I always say because
In equity, like if we really talk about women's right and all that,
we use the term economic empowerment of women a lot, right?
But if you really go to finance people, they are like, okay, I understand economic,
but what is this empowerment? This looks so difficult, right? And so
But they do talk about financial inclusion. They do targeting, you know, and so I think
The more you talk, you start to identify that there are certain
commonalities in substance that each sector has or have.
And then your job is to really identify that and bring it together. That's second.
But at times, sometimes you find that some people are really not giving you
the vibe of discussion and conversation and you really don't have the patience and energy.
take a break, right?
I always say, okay, let's revisit this after two weeks.
And that helps hugely, right? Because I think sometimes we
We all have, and especially in development space, I would say people are so
kind of busy with the work and they have always
some deadlines and reports and all that coming on and sometime when
we pick on this conversation, the timing needs to be right,
right? And if you feel that people are not really responding.
They could also be really pressed between deadlines and they really
don't want to think about a new topic. So in those
Moments allowing yourself and that person the space
And say, let's revisit this
It's super helpful.
So I think be that person and then you will find
that people actually open up and they also want to find
ways to work with you. It's both ways. I think
most of the people want to work together but sometimes
they don't really have the, I think, patience language and skill set to bridge that space.
That is wonderful. I love that. You know, as a
Director of Women and Gender, I have students often ask me.
my strategy, you know, how to be successful
And what you said first about basically
following your instinct and what's important and maintaining networks
I think are in developing and building networks are things that I always say but
Patience is something that I usually put in my New Year's
resolution every year. It's been many, many years.
I haven't achieved it yet, but I think
That's also a great strategy and to have informal conversations with people and
to realize that they don't actually understand where you're coming from. So breaking it down to
smaller ways of describing what you do and being patient with other people who
don't understand. I think those are just wonderful strategies.
I'm sure they're serving you well at the World Resources Institute.
I want to congratulate you for your wisdom, you're not that old but you're becoming very wise
And I hope you're becoming very effective in your work there.
Thank you so much. Thank you. Yeah, wiser. And I think I'm easing beautifully, I would say.
Well…
But I always feel that I think the learning of both technical and social sciences helps
a lot. So I would also say like if you're a student or even a faculty,
read a lot about the other person's work as well, because
like that nowadays I read so much about finance,
right? About this neocolonialistic models, right? And I'm like.
okay how do I, you know, like breeze this like this is a gray area and things like
that. So I think reading helps a lot. At least it gives you some
conceptual awareness of where you are landing in.
And then use some of the strategies that I think I and Maria Alicia shared.
Yep.
Yeah, and my team is good. I would say that in Old Resource Institute,
I was able to do this work because of one.
People really want to do this work, but they simply didn't know how,
right? So really creating that niche was very helpful.
And second, there are champions who really are committed on these issues, right?
So I think identifying who the champions are and mobilizing them forward is a team
and putting collective efforts really made the efforts possible, basically.
Wonderful. Well, thank you for your professional presentation
and your personal advice. I think a lot of people
Not only listening today, but as I say,
this will be recorded. So people will come back and listen to it.
Again, so thank you so much. And thank you everybody who joined us today.
Have a wonderful day. Hope to see you in the spring. Kalpana,
I hope you will join us also for check our topics in the spring.
Maybe there'll be something that's interesting to you. So thank you,
everybody. And thank you so much.